Missing prospectors

First topic message reminder :

Two prospectors missing on channel 9 news
No more imfo.

The search is on again

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-07-06/jennie-kehlet-missing-prospectors-fresh-search-near-sandstone/6597692

The cops obviously have no clue

Better article & map of the area here

http://www.heraldsun.com.au/news/national/major-crime-squad-update-on-raymond-and-jennie-kehlet-sandstone-mystery/story-fnii5thm-1227430197287

I'm not sure if they will ever find Jenny. It's a sad ending but they never found the other man out Menzies way either.
Hopefully one day they will be found and put to rest.

Bignuggs wrote:I'm not sure if they will ever find Jenny.  It's a sad ending but they never found the other man out Menzies way either.
Hopefully one day they will be found and put to rest.

While I was away the missus said that they were starting another 7 day search in a new area, never heard any more about it, just wondered if they were going on new information or just trying searching another possible direction she may have gone in if she was lost, seems to me that as time is of the essence in these situations that parties should have been sent in all directions at the same time to cover all the bases.

Also read that remains that were found in a sleeping bag off the side of the road 30klms or so east of Kal were recently identified a belonging to a Dutch bloke that has been missing for 9 years, said he was diabetic and had heart problems so may have died from natural causes, so no foul play was suspected, you would have to wonder what someone with medical issues, particularly a heart condition would be doing wandering the country on foot?

Last season we ran in to the family of the bloke that went missing between Meekatharra and the coast, he was driving a van and towing a trailer I believe, he went in to the Meeka cop shop for directions to the coast I think he wanted to go through to Carnarvon to meet up with a mate, apparently he never showed up and they searched for some time but didn't find a trace, also the family were up there looking as well, as far as I have heard he has never been found, anybody else heard anything?

au-fever

Talk about clutching at straws...

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-07-20/missing-prospectors-kehlet-search-pet-dog-clue/6633140

It's a mystery and a sad story. But, I have been wondering why the dog looked "stuffed" when it was found in Sandstone.

Seems to me that WAPOL stuffed this investigation up from day 1, lost a lot of possible evidence and now are trying to redeem themselves. Just saying.

Bignuggs wrote:It's a mystery and a sad story.  But, I have been wondering why the dog looked "stuffed" when it was found in Sandstone.

First I heard that the dog was found wandering around the caravan park, then a short time back a bloke that was in the area said that a road crew found the dog wandering along the Payne's Find - Sandstone road heading towards Payne's Find, picked it up and brought it into Sandstone.

Too little information from the cops and too many conflicting stories to even get half an idea of what really went on?

au-fever

Anyway you look at it, it just doesn't look right. Someone knows something and they aren't telling.
Apart from that, make sure of your own safety.

Channel 7 Sunday Night program
Having a full story on this

Many unanswered questions;

https://au.news.yahoo.com/sunday-night/features/a/29162059/wa-missing-prospectors-friend-speaks-out/

This is what the bloke that camped with them said...

"Graham was the last person to be with the couple at their camp and told Sunday Night when he returned after a solo walk on March 22 and packed up.
"I was out for all day and most of the night. And got back to camp early hours"

When he arrived back in the early hours of March 22, He saw the dog Ella and thought Ray and Jennie were asleep in their tent, then left at around 3am without saying good bye to return to Perth."

Does anyone else find this statement odd    

When you are prospecting together in the scrub you you have set rules & times on your where abouts If I'm not back by such & such, I'll be down around so & so....

Who would be wandering around in the dark without a reason (unless he night raided a patch, even then if you knew you were going home you'd be packed & ready that day)

If it was going to be wet... You'd tell em..

Just saying...... it doesn't add up..

yep very odd
who packs up and leaves at 3am without saying goodbye to the couple your out bush with [unless they are arguing] you would jump in the swag for a couple hours to get some shut eye before the 7 hour trip home.
i also see that apparently gunshots were heard in the area, by who?? Graham didn't mention that did he? and if so he should have woken them and said something in stead off doing a runner.
gunshots could also just have been roo shooters, on which if pastoralist had been notified pro roo shooters would have been aware prospectors are in the area and to stay clear.
so many unanswered questions, so much speculation but apparently no foul play
yeah right!!

we all have our theory's i know i have mine but this is a public forum so i'll shut me trap

If this man is innocent, then he can thank Sunday night for people thinking otherwise. Their questioning was very poor. I also think the pepper spray found is very disturbing, more so than the guns.

I dont know about you guys but theres no way on earth that I would be able to detect all day and then through the night until 2am the next morning, that is the most unbelievable statement that I have heard, as unless you were lost yourself then there no way you would be wandering about for that amount of time, cant see that it would be physically possible.

No matter what the hour you would tell the people you were with that you were back as they would be thinking you were lost as well, and further to that tell them that you were packing up and heading home, not just take off, the whole story in my mind is unplausible but until evidence is found or the truth told we will never know.

I pity the family having had no closure on the matter.

au-fever

Seems 5 cops are back in Sandstone on Monday 17th August

Apparently the camp site is now an official crime scene.

And the suspect... well no guesses there..

Viper wrote:Seems 5 cops are back in Sandstone on Monday 17th August

Apparently the camp site is now an official crime scene.

And the suspect... well no guesses there..

Wow what a surprise?, didn't take them long to work that one out did it? , talk about "closing the gate after the horse has bolted" any evidence that might have been in the camp has been obliterated by now with all the activity, really in light of the suspicious circumstances and the death of Ray the place should have been a crime scene right from the start, not a couple of months in.

au-fever

A SEARCH is underway for three people in missing in remote WA, near the location prospectors Raymond and Jennie Kehlet went missing from in March.

A Boddington couple and their son have been missing for almost three days, after leaving Windsor Station five days ago.

The station is about 500km north of Perth, between Mount Magnet and Sandstone, where the Kehlets went missing earlier this year.

This place starting to sound like Bermuda Triangle/wolf creek.
I'm sure this lot will turn up safe.

https://au.news.yahoo.com/thewest/wa/a/29469494/family-missing-in-wa-outback/

When the Khelets went missing they had a vehicle left behind and a quad bike.. and the guy last seen with them also had a vehicle... (3 people and 2 vehicles)

Seems strange, both vehicles and 3 people are again missing?
Wolf Creek all over again?.

Maybe there's more $ in killing prospectors and selling their detectors, than there is in finding gold?

This keeps up & shares in Minlelabs could plummet...... who's gonna go out in the goldfields - even in company? Might be time to start wearing a sidearm... and revert back to a time when "Arms Control" meant being able to hit the bullseye 9 outta 10 with your .45 Colt peacemaker!.

Or have your 2 best mates for backup - Smith And Wesson.

It occurs to me that, IF you had one of these hidden in your car...

http://www.ezitrak.com.au/ Friends and relatives could track your vehicles movements & location in situations like this where people just vanish.

Obviously a PLB would work if your away from the vehicle also... but I am thinking where a vehicle/s are missing or taken at least if someone else stole the vehicle - you could download every where it's been (like to abandoned mine shafts for eg) from the black box, remotely which might aid future searches for remains or whatever. They also have a panic button....

Speculation is over, all three safe & well.
http://www.abc.net.au/news/2015-09-09/police-search-for-missing-family-in-sandstone/6760782

That is good news.

However,

Its past time that it was mandatory to carry PLB's / EPIRBS when prospecting!

Maybe if these 3 copped a $50K fine they wouldn't skimp on essential equipment.

I think there's something else we need to do also - no Epirb signal received = no search at taxpayer expense. Sorry chum ya shyte outta luck - got yaself into this pickle - better get yaself out coz no ones coming looking for ya without an epirb.

Once upon a time you could go to sea without an epirb - but the coroner found that 2 of 3 guys lost at sea off Busso who perished from hypothermia overnight (the 3rd one was the fat guy who survived cos his body mass took longer for his core body temp to drop, and was still alive when rescued by the media chopper at first light in the morning) - could have been saved IF they had been carrying an Epirb to allow them to be found at night!

Govt took up coroners recommendation to make epirbs mandatory and legislated it!.

Why wouldn't the detector manufacturers build in an epirb as standard equipment into their detector... your lost & you push the button - too simple... an 406 mhtz epirb costs what? $300 or $400?

The fricken detectors are $10,500 and they don't come with one?

Unbelievable.

Until we get serious about this crap nothing will ever change.

Same with the cars should all be GPS tracked. Commercial fishing boats have to have it.

Get stopped by plod outside the metro area without a GPS tracker equipped car = $50,000 fine.

When will we wake up?

When people starts copping the 3 or 4 hundred grand bill for the search for them. Suddenly that $300 or $400 EPIRB will seem like "cheap insurance" which is exactly what it is!.

Hell a sat Sleeve for their smart phone would probably have saved that search cost!

Maybe if the prospecting / mining industry put a submission to govt for self regulation the legislation and enforcement wouldn't be necessary.

But if you leave it up to people to just do the right thing, I reckon 90+ % of those out there detecting won't have any GPS / satellite capability to obviate expensive searches when it invariably goes wrong.

A simple 12V ciggy lighter operated portable compressor and a $40 supercheap tire plug kit and these peons would have been home safe!

What does it take?

We are human beings with the brain capacity to decided our own fate, so they say.
When you consider the money we spend on our 4x4's, camping gear and detecting gear, then the cost of a PLB is nothing, less than $300
How many people have actually told the local police where they are going and when they will be back ? I won't guess.
How many times have you all gone out without telling your family where you are ?
As for carrying firearms, my answer is "NO" but, thats just my opinion and I don't see the law ever changing. It's hard enuff just getting and holding a firearms license.

Has there been any more developments?, last I heard they were going back again to the scene and had a suspect?, never heard another thing about it?

au-fever

7 D's in Sandstone through the week.... taking finger prints & DNA from the locals.... & get this all at the caravan park.... must think everyone stays there full time

Seems a little "Odd" to me?.

There are pretty strict laws about collecting DNA...

Without your consent, the only way to get DNA by force is with a warrant signed by a Judge unless your actually "under arrest" for a felony crime.

When your arrested they can take DNA which will then make it to the CODIS data base... but if your acquitted they are s'posed to delete the DNA record, but they never do.

Example would be - when stopped for a booze bus or roadside drug swab, and you blow thru the tube - your DNA from your saliva is on the tube and they have your drivers license number/details etc. IF they kept the tubes & added your MDL number to a sticker on a zip lock bag with the tube in it - they could then have every tube analyzed for DNA & add everyone's DNA that they stop, to their criminal DNA data base (CODIS).. who never committed a crime. This is why some folks demand their tube back after they have blown below 0.5 roadside - to prevent just that - illegal gathering of DNA.

You CAN Volunteer to give your DNA sample if asked, in order to eliminate you if you have nothing to hide for e.g.

BUT it pays to remember that it's not IMPOSSIBLE to fake DNA. It's not easy, but it can be done (from blood samples with use of a high speed medical centrifuge).

In essence you could get 2 blood samples from 2 different people with 2 different blood types (Say Type A & Type O)and spin them up in a high speed medical centrifuge, and separate the red platelets in the blood from the white blood cells (blood plasma). If you draw off the white cells with a pipette that contains all the dna info - and swap the plasma from each sample, you could "create a blood sample with DNA from the other person but the wrong blood TYPE to physically be YOU"!

Of Course - if the 2 blood samples are the same blood type - then your "in heap big trouble paleface" coz blood type will then match also!. No way to prove it wasn;t you!

So DNA can be faked. It isn't 100% foolproof. Exact Twins for e.g. also share the same DNA.

The thing is, can you trust Police with your DNA?

There are guys even now (Robyn McCartney - murdered Lalita Horesman in Geraldton) who's appealing his conviction coz a saliva sample on her singlet or something claimed to be his & used in evidence to convict him, has after more than a decade now been "re-tested" and found NOT to actually be his!).

And of course WAPOL have a sorry past record of convicting innocents on "fitted up" evidence...John Button convicted of his G/Friends murder - who turned out to be one of Eric Cooks victims, Darryle Beamish, Ray, Peter & Brian Mickelberg, Andrew Mallard, all "fitted up" by bent cops at WAPOL.

With that sort of past record and the fact that DNA CAN be altered/faked - means that only an idiot would WILLINGLY give WAPOL your DNA, if they don't have a warrant to take it by force, just in order to be eliminated, coz once its in the CODIS data base, it's there forever!.

And even if you have nothing to hide - with the development of a new technique called "familial DNA sequencing" invented to ID 3000+ people killed in the 9/11 twin towers, from minute scraps of human remains located... YOUR DNA can actually be used to narrow down and convict other members of your family who's DNA isn't even in the data base (so one of your own kids, grand kids, or say cousins etc).

http://www.boston.com/news/science/articles/2010/10/31/whodunit/

Just coz your staying at a caravan park in Sandstone, isn't sufficient legal reason for WAPOL to take DNA samples without a warrant.

No way I would willingly give WAPOL My DNA - even tho I have nothing to hide... that is of no protection these days... Let them get a warrant, and if/when your cleared, have a lawyer make 100% sure the record is expunged from their CODIS data base (Criminal Offender DNA Information System).

YMMV (your mileage may vary).