Pastoral leaseholders rights..

If u r out there in a stations paddock be mindful that if the pastoralist is mustering that he can ask u to leave failing this u will be evicted by the police if matters get out of hand and charged with causing a nuisance.


U should be telling the lease holder of your presence just in case something untoward happens and u need help. At least someone else knows were u r.

just because u have a miners right there are certain matters which over ride your right to prospect..


Winter time is mustering time---So have a bit of respect for others irrespective of your so called right to prospect.

regards
oneday

True Ray. It's common sense to let them know where you will be.
Pretty damn hard to find a pastoral lease that actually has stock on it tho.
A lot of the leases are empty of stock and the P&GA or Pastoral companies will tell you that when you contact them.

not all leases are rested..
I'm talking about the Pilbra and Ashburton areas.

a lot of those leases bordering the desert are destocked.

Prospectors haven't got a absolute right to go and trespass regardless.

regards
oneday

Gotta disagree with ya there.  yes we can't go where there are stock movements which are usually temporary but a pastoral lease holder cannot stop you from entering the lease.
We are not trespassing, we are only exercising our right under the Act as it stands.
Pastoral lease holders are trying to stop us completely from entering.  If that happens, it's the end of the Miners Right and detecting as we know it.
so I hope someone can explain to me, why mining companies can do what they like and they do, but we are treated differently.

PS. I have some first hand knowledge or stories if you like, where drilling mobs or mining companies have entered pastoral leases without notifying the lease holder and they ripped the shite out of the place, made a mess and left crap everywhere. But guess who gets the blame for making a mess.

most station owners that i have spoken with let us on to their stations to chase gold,and shoot wild dogs

Same red devil , iv mostly got along with 99 percent of them , when they say they are mustering ,show respect & always take your non perishable rubbish out with you & keep clear of stock watering points .... however some think their PASTORAL LEASE is their own property , no its not , they can freehold it if they choose , it will cost them , then they can have claims when they say things like how would you like it if I was in your backyard etc & until that happens it is only a right for them to use the grass for grazing animals after all . We all have to get along & share the CROWN LAND which has varied purposes , its a 2 way street , anhow , be good.

There is the odd one that uses mustering as an excuse to attempt deny access, they seem to be mustering 24/7 x 365   

All this has been discussed before on this forum, some in this link. Some of the info supplied by the P&GA and Gov Departments was wrong and a response was posted on the forum from APLA. when I find it again, I'll post the link.
It was also found, that an official brochure put out by DMP gave wrong information and had to be withdrawn. once again APLA were on the ball and got it fixed.

http://www.detectingwestaustraliangold.com/t821p25-station-owner-charging-for-camping-on-a-section-20a

More.

Thanks Cliff . also its good to have copies of your  rights/ permits if needed  with you ,in case  if the police are called & you are being interfered with going about you lawful business . Not many young or old coppers for that matter are up to speed on this stuff . Anyhow I try & get on with them , if you call in have the chat of your intentions ,show them the necessary paper work if things go tricky , its usually good .That's  my experiences with it anyway.albo.

so I hope someone can explain to me, why mining companies can do what they like and they do, but we are treated differently.

Its called money! And we don't give any except our pissy 25 bucks once in our lifetime. Pretty simple really.

Hi Hoolahoopa,

Perhaps you could explain what the mining companies do that we can't, most businesses have very strict rules to abide by and if we wanted to do what they do we would have to abide by the same rules, I think where it all breaks down is the fly by nighters who rape and pillage is where the problem lies, but that's just my observations

True they do leave a mess wherever they go as in not filling in their holes(all those super pits out there, drill holes not capped, the list goes on but when a companies money dries up or they go into receivership(which happens often) things don't get done and are not followed up, so I reckon it's the minders that aren't doin their jobs more so

Note: I fill my holes in....mostly, but when you see the gradings and the mess left behind especially now that they are making them push all the dirt back over the gradings, it makes you wonder why should we fill in our scrapings as the pile of dirt alongside your scrapes are ten times more of a mess than your little scraping

If I do the right thing for me at the time I can walk with me head held high and to hell with what anyone else does, if it's in my back yard then that's a different story!!

Ron

If you type into the forum search function "Pastoral Leases", geez we have talked about this a lot but it always makes for interesting discussion.
Here's the content of a post from 2012, I won't name who posted it but I'll highlight a section that maybe needs some further research by way of a letter to the Commissioner of Police for the Police response to this issue.

"Gents

I have just applyed for one (40A) and had a great chat to the gent at the mines dep

They will send you the contact details for the land owner ( Cocky ) if they are not on the Do Not Contact List
Some of the Cockys have asked that Prospector with 20a's do not get there information
If the cocky is not on the list then this information will be given to you in the pack
He also told me that when you have the 20a they have no right to move you on or try to kick you off the land
He went on to say if you have any issues with the cocky then contact the Police as they know the law with the 20a and they will set the cocky right.  You would hope it would never get this far but you ( the Prospector ) has the right to pass and coduct your prospecting as much as you like over the 10 weeks
You can also take water from any well except within 200 mtrs of the homested
Just letting you know what I found out the other day"    

Now, in a previous post about Pastoral Lease holders, it was suggested that they have the right to get the Police to remove you from the lease.
So, here's the question.
We have a Miners Right and we abide by the Mining Act.
You might or maybe you don't, contact the pastoral lease holder and tell them where you will be.  It's best if you did tell them, it's called the "Good Neighbour" policy.
You might only be going on Pending ground, you might have the permission from a Company or you have jumped thru all the hoops and got your 40A permits.
You have done all the legal things required and you have not caused any damage to station property.
The pastoral lease holder may or may not have a permit to charge a camping fee and you have refused to pay when they asked for it coz you are camped out in the scrub away from the station camping facilities and you are not hindering station operations.
You can add more to the list but you have done all that is humanly possible to do the right thing.
So where does it all end ?  buggered if I know but here's something else.
There is mention of a "Code of Conduct".  From memory, this so called "Code" was written by self interested groups and APLA were never consulted about it and I think they totally disagreed with it as it ignored the Law.  Correct me if I'm wrong about that.
So what would I do ?  Until they change, I'll use the laws and exercise my legal rights.
Here's some replies I got from APLA
If the pastoralist is running camping stays, tourism events or tours then they can charge a fee for those services if you use them. If they provide a camp ground with facilities that you use then they can charge fees for this.

However as the user of a Miner’s Right if you are independent of the pastoralists facilities and services then you are entitled to have your own camp, provided you are prospecting (and not just fishing on the beach etc) and they cannot charge you a fee.

They can charge if they can demonstrate damage or wear and tear to their facilities or improvements that they have put in on the station. This includes roads, so if you drive when wet and leave ruts they can charge for repair. Same if you use their water. Bit unreasonable to charge for general access.

The problem started when some pastoralists charged camping access to get to beaches and nice waterholes, and wise guys tried to use the Miner’s Right to get around paying. Catch was they were using the Miner’s Right for non-prospecting activities and can’t do this. This started the issue of the Caravan and Camping Act, but this Act does not apply to the Miner’s Right holder provide the holder is genuinely prospecting.

The other problem was pastoralists running prospecting tours and overnight camping in shearers quarters. They did not want non-paying prospectors on the station. However in this case we recommend members talk to the station owner and look at camping out of the way of their tours where possible so as to keep the peace, obviously they don’t want fee paying customers complaining when they see you doing it for free.

So hopefully this answers the question, as you don’t have to pay if you don’t use their services. Any problems then the IEB (investigation unit) at the mines dept will contact the pastoralist and remind them of their obligations towards the prospector. Naturally we are here to help.


My advice is to always make contact with the pastoralist and let them know that you:

• are a bon-fide prospector
• are aware of the regulations and guidelines
• are an APLA member
• will report any suspicious activity to them and the IEB
• give them your vehicle details and rego (so if they see you they know who you are and what you are up to)

this usually helps break the ice. Even if they are grumpy it goes a long way.

DMP should provide details so you can make contact in advance. Always deal with DMP as DRD&L are in a different world.


Cheers and Best of Luck to all detectorists
Cliff

PS.  I've now got a headache and it's time for a beer       

well done & thanks Cliff , I hope the dcks that make a mess , cut fences , shoot stock etc and make our right to roam harder these days get the point .