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Smooth timings addiction

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rc62burke
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Post by Narrawa Fri 24 Feb 2012, 7:34 am

First topic message reminder :

How many out there are addicted to just the smooth class of timings.?

Having been an eastern states operator i was not always taken in by the smooth timings, admittedly i do use them often now but keep active with the use of s/extra timing as often as i can. Switching from one to the other is tiresome but rewarding....not always gold at the bottom of a hole but a target none the less on most occasions.
This all started for me with the 4000 as i was not taken in with s/smooth for some time when i first got the machine. Finding more benefit from the s/smooth timing mainly when storm activity was rampage. Flicking into s/smooth gave me some relief from two out of the three forms of interferences present while detecting. Ground noise and hot rocks virtually eliminated leaving mostly atmospherics to deal with.
The lack of depth was an issue after a while of only digging shallow targets, however the odd deepish targets were still being dug out and many being gold. The big clincher came from working a notorious hot rock area where the use of S/E was tormenting to say the least. Testing the ability of s/smooth to detect a suspect hot rock and switching back to S/E for the comparison, soon saw me opting to use s/smooth more often as the target turned out to be a nice bit of gold below the rock. Where as S/E was more of a broad signal hiding the lower target.
After some time of seeing the benefit you become all to addicted to the smooth thresh and before long your a full blown addict. Retraining yourself to use the older timings becomes almost imposable. Most opt to use one of the smooth timings over ground that its not really warranted on. This leaves gold in the ground for others to find and the circle of gold being found on flogged fields by many will always be so.

Iv had a go at showing others how to set up their GPXs to work ground that we found gold in with the GP series, and the attitude has mostly been bias towards the smooth timings...possibly because they had no time with the GP series working the same ground we are now with the GPXs.

A simple test for old and new operators is to find a subtle target in your chosen smooth timing, switch over to S/E and alter the detector so its able to work the ground around the target. Once your GB is set and the ground around is now quite as it was in your smooth timing, wave it over the target.
When shown how to do this, most freak out at the very low gain setting to enable the detector to GB properly and shit themselves once waved over the target....yet remark at the quietness of the detector when switched from a smooth timing to a normal timing.

Certainly not gospel, just a method thats worked for me and a few that report back the same.

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Post by Guest Mon 27 Feb 2012, 3:25 pm

Narrawa wrote: .but im still gunna tell her it was my idea.:rolf:

While ya on it tell her " it only works if ya wear this 2lt ice-cream tub for a hat luv" Razz Razz

Man dont tell her i said that :rolf: :rolf: remember its all your doin lol!

Gawd imagine she pulls a 20ozer with that get up on, stranger things happen Razz Razz Razz

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Post by Narrawa Mon 27 Feb 2012, 4:14 pm

You should not put ideas of laughter into my head mate....you know i'll run a muck with any such thoughts.
I'll have you a picture of this soon...mark my words.....and mate!......i wont tell her, you told me to do it i promise. lol!

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Post by Guest Tue 28 Feb 2012, 7:30 am

Crazy Pete wrote:

While ya on it tell her " it only works if ya wear this 2lt ice-cream tub for a hat luv" Razz Razz


Is it better if it's still full?
Is neapolitan better than vanilla or chocolate?

Robert

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Post by rc62burke Tue 28 Feb 2012, 9:45 am

Hi Guys
There is some great info coming out in this thread, I have a lowly SD2200d,

Hi Pete
Can you please elaborate on the "Bogene" settings for the SD2200 please,

This forum is awesome for the sharing of info that goes on in all respects & by guys that actually get onto gold.
Thanks HEAPS All
Lee
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Post by Guest Tue 28 Feb 2012, 12:16 pm

Top post Narrawa, one of the few I have read from start to finish lately. Fell into that trap myself last year with ENHANCED being my prefered setting on the 4500 then boosting the GAIN and running audio on BOOST or DEEP. These days I check the ground first in NORMAL and adjust the GAIN til it becomes a bit unstable then back off a bit.
If its tolerable I persist in this mode before going to ENHANCED as a last option. The signal response I found to deeper targets in NORMAL is a lot more clear compared to ENHANCED.
Haven't tried S/E yet because I thought you loose depth with it and it would be a bit to noisy on the types of ground here in VIC I usually detect but might give it a whirl next time to see if I can see some benefit in it.

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Post by Boulder Tue 28 Feb 2012, 1:04 pm

An interesting topic choice. Something I have noticed since shifting from a 3000 to a 5000 is the 3000's Normal timing to me handled noisier ground better than Normal timing on the 5000. Therefore I have had to revert back to using the Smooth Timings.

Boulder


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Post by Guest Wed 29 Feb 2012, 7:18 am

I believe Edison had some 5000 goes at perfecting the light bulb so I guess experimenting with just a few hundred detector settings is a "walk in the park".

I think we would all benefit from seeing what response we get from various settings when we have a signal under our coil instead of going hammer and tongues at it to dig it up.
It's quite amazing to hear the different responses in different timings and other settings.
Do yourself a favour and try it out.

Robert

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Post by Guest Wed 29 Feb 2012, 9:41 am

Hi Lee

Bogene's settings are basically running on the most flat out sensitive settings you can muster
on any machine, but because that would make her squeal and moan on bad or salty ground
the way was to turn the threshold right down so only the definite signals came through and
not just the moaning and groaning.
Some people agree on this some dont like the setting.

Bogene is a member here, perhaps he might chirp in with some more info mate.

Pete

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Post by lkyphl Fri 02 Mar 2012, 7:59 am

An interesting topic ; on Wednesday I changed many settings before digging five different targets I found (in the Triangle) and the clearest signal (GPX5000) was from FG. The ground was wet, 8" mono, deep audio, gain 14, stab 10, fixed, very slow motion, headphones.
Enhance and SE were about even over this ground, just slightly less "sharp" than FG, normal was pretty poor, and SS was barely audible.

Phil

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Post by Boulder Fri 02 Mar 2012, 12:10 pm

Phil

I often change between the three GPX Smooth class of timings over a suspect target to compare signal responses and I too have found FG the clearest. When switched into the Normal timing it usually produces the loudest response but unfortunately so does the ground. Have tried dropping the Gain for little improvement. Mineralisation is the dictator.

Were your five targets gold?

Gaz


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Post by rc62burke Fri 02 Mar 2012, 3:18 pm

Crazy Pete wrote:Hi Lee

Bogene's settings are basically running on the most flat out sensitive settings you can muster
on any machine, but because that would make her squeal and moan on bad or salty ground
the way was to turn the threshold right down so only the definite signals came through and
not just the moaning and groaning.
Some people agree on this some dont like the setting.

Bogene is a member here, perhaps he might chirp in with some more info mate.

Pete

Hi Pete
What would the most sensiitive settings be on the SD2200d, I guess this would also depend upon the coil size, is that right?
Bogene? is that his user name here or is it something else, I understand you probably can't actually give us his name, privacy and all Political correctness CRAP.
thanks, very interested to squeeze a little more out of the old girl (detector that is )
cheers
Lee
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Post by Makaw Fri 02 Mar 2012, 4:21 pm

My technical settings are as follows.
FG and crank up gain as high as possible. If it quietens down because of benign ground crank it more..
And stabiliser as low as possible.
If i GB and its too quiet, crank the gain again.. And drop the threshold more.
I am on obsessive compulsive button and knob turner...
I try to run as high as possible where ever possible.. Cant say it works for me, because all the gold migrated west millions of years ago...

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Post by Guest Fri 02 Mar 2012, 4:56 pm

Hi Lee

Shallow mode is the best sens mate, but that also needs to be combined with a small mono coil
to pick out the tiny buggers, and run in Fixed, also see my post on "frequency Tweak" below.

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Pete.
off for a fish down the river Very Happy

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Post by rc62burke Fri 02 Mar 2012, 5:26 pm

Hi Pete
Thanks for that, I thought that might be the case, I have a Sadie coil so I will give it a go on the next trip, my problem has been I don't get out enough,
I had a look at that post about the tweak & copied what you said a couple of weeks ago, so I have a bit to play with.
cheers
Lee
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Post by Inhere Fri 02 Mar 2012, 6:19 pm

If you go over to finders and put "bogenes method" in the search you should get the full story Lee.
That is where he revealed it and there is a bit more to it than you have heard here. Wink
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Post by rc62burke Fri 02 Mar 2012, 6:53 pm

Inhere wrote:If you go over to finders and put "bogenes method" in the search you should get the full story Lee.
That is where he revealed it and there is a bit more to it than you have heard here. Wink

Hi Inhere
Thanks for that I will check it out.
cheers
Lee
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Post by Inhere Fri 02 Mar 2012, 9:36 pm

Sorry Lee, I gave you a bum steer, heres the link to bogenes settings.

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Post by lkyphl Sat 03 Mar 2012, 1:27 pm

Boulder wrote:Phil

Were your five targets gold?

Gaz


Yes, Gaz, they were all littlies, twelve for 0.98 grams Rolling Eyes

Phil

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Post by Flakmagnet Sun 04 Mar 2012, 1:35 pm

Another great thread Narrawa.
I think this series of posts of yours
and some posts earlier by B. Pete are potential revelations
for anyone who takes the time to apply the information.

Enhance or S/E with Deep Audio settings
combined with a willingness to mess with gain, stabilizer and some of the other setting
with the added willingness of a slight discomfort at the listening level
(putting up with a touch of a ragged threshold),
can really put some fun (and some gold) into a days hunt.

These machines are much more than the sum of their parts.

Thank you for taking the time to put your experience down for us.
It is always appreciated and never taken for granted.


Last edited by Flakmagnet on Mon 05 Mar 2012, 1:27 am; edited 1 time in total
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Post by Inhere Sun 04 Mar 2012, 2:13 pm

Boulder wrote:An interesting topic choice. Something I have noticed since shifting from a 3000 to a 5000 is the 3000's Normal timing to me handled noisier ground better than Normal timing on the 5000. Therefore I have had to revert back to using the Smooth Timings.

G'day guys, has anyone else found this?
I have had a very experienced prospector tell me his SD2200 +a 14" coiltek mono was quite on a piece of ground in NSW.
and his new 5000 and his mates 4500 was much noisier with a mono over the same ground in normal.

He has only had it out a couple of times here because of the rain.

What do you guys think???
Inhere
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Post by Guest Sun 04 Mar 2012, 2:25 pm


Could be a slight possibility of that being true, due to the sd2200 having no where near as much
sensitivity as either of the GPX's you mentioned.
But that being said the 2xGPX machines in the right hands would have been able to be tamed to
handle that same ground easily.
There is only so much that settings can do, without a good driver behind the wheel....
I know blokes in WA who claim to be good operators and have been detecting 20 yrs or more
but in actual fact they arnt that crash hot due to the gold being easy to find in the early part of
their detecting yrs, and so they never really had to hone their skills but still "Killed the Pig'..

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Post by Narrawa Sun 04 Mar 2012, 4:27 pm

Might have something to do with SETA.??

I was always told the new models were about 8 on the gain, which is the closest to the older models. Yet if you try to GB over the same ground as a 3500 that has no probs GBing, something tells you its not right. Could be a number of other things adding to the sensitivity of the new ones. Just knowing that and being able to now alter it is a good reason to jump into any of the GPXs.





Flak, much appreciate the comments mate.

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Post by Inhere Sun 04 Mar 2012, 9:24 pm

Thanks guy's, I know you can quite them down and he got 22 gram between rain at Hargraves, so he's not doing too shabby
but the 2200, while it was a great detector in it day, was not really noted for being good to use with a mono, so I doubt that the ground was that hot.

So I was a little surprised at the 4500/5000. Sure they are more sensitive in the new timings than the GP's but I didn't think there would be much difference in normal other than you could manually increase gain, or decrease gain.
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Post by Guest Sun 04 Mar 2012, 10:15 pm

The 45 & 5k are more sensitive in every range of settings than the sd & gp range, a lot of people
think that its just a software update in them but its a whole new circuitry revamp and platform..
The 2200d wasnt to shabby using a mono, i used to use a 24x12 Ufo on one with not to much
problems except for when the ground was wet or very damp, then i would use a 11" mono.

Pete

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Post by Narrawa Mon 05 Mar 2012, 12:12 am

Big change in audio, one thats taken some getting use to and i still prefer the audio from the GPs.

Increasing the gain or decreasing it on the GPXs is just a small way of stabilizing the machine.
Add motion audio and stabilizer settings and your normal timing can come alive.
Hook a small coil like the 10x5 up to it and flick it into cancel using a DD coil and you have a very steady machine with bulk adjustments.....Small coils are optimized for sensitivity by design and mate well with cancel when all else fails.
Toss a big coil on and do the same for added depth.??

If the ground is hot, to hot to work with an SD or GP using a mono, we use to switch over to a DD coil.
Now days we are able to work these grounds with a mono coil on the GPXs......but the ground has not changed has it.?? You have to work out the benefit of opting for another attack method on your ground. The only thing new about doing this is the amount of combos you now face. Razz Laughing
There is however some clauses in that.......
Given the amount of rain the ground has received over the last xamount of weeks in the eastern states.....salt and mineralization will be on the rise and will cause some grief in enhance...possibly FG and a few others.




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